I sold my home and the building inpector stated that one of the plugs in kitchen needs to be a gfi. The problem I have is the plug is joined to another that I found in wall when doing back splash and does not have a receptical on it. I left it as is and placed a plate on it as its over sink. Problem I have is there is red white and black and panel is old, house was built in 90s.
Question I have is it code as is or do I need to make all these changes as no electrical work was done, nothing added or changed.
I'm being told different things from electricians. Some say leave it as is its code for when house was built. Some say it can be changed if they can change breaker which is not made anymore. Another says if a gfi is places now it will trip breaker if more than one thing plugged in.
I'm just trying to pass inspection and trying to see if it really needs to be changed.
It's a commander box.
So long as you haven't done a substantial renovation in the kitchen recently and the last time the walls were open was during the old code, then you are fine. No need to do anything.
Old kitchen receptacles are split so the top and bottom are essentially two different circuits, tied together in the panel. The problem with this is it makes it hard to make a gfi that will work. That is why newer code uses a completely different wiring method. If you do a substantial reno it should be updated, but otherwise it's totally fine.
Hi Jason,
You should update to a GFI receptacle if your building inspector says to. Just choose one circuit of your split plug to use and you could use the other color wire remaining for the other receptacle and install another GFI for more counter plugs providing both receptacles are 1.2M or less to sink. As for the wiring this is the way it was prior and does not need to be updated unless walls are opened.
In Ontario, the existing wiring does not require a gfci in that location. Your inspector does not know the grandfather rule of existing installations not needing updating unless you touch the wiring. I am not clear why you capped off the 2nd outlet, but that would be an illegal move to cap it off. Best thing to do is to call a few ESA registered contractors in your area and ask their opinions on how to best tackle your concerns. There are rules that allow it to remain, however, upgrading it to gfci could be done by a breaker in the panel, faceless gfci protection beside the panel, or rewiring the outlet to make it 2 gfci outlets side by side in the same box.
The second box was hidden in wall from builders in the 90s when I did back splash I found it behind old backsplash I had spoken to a electrician said I would have to change the breaker but breakers are from a commander box which I can't find that's the problem if I don't need to do to old code what do I do to prove this so it does not have to be done.
Get an ESA inspection done on the home.
Would it just be easier to eliminate that line and run a new one from box to a gfi meaning taking out second line also second box is empty can just cut a hole on bottom near floor and run a line up and down through floor to box.
Hello,
Both previous electricians are correct, as it is grandfathered in and is acceptable by esa as no work was done, if you insist on having it gfi protected, as stated earlier it might be best to go with the faceless gfi route.
Hi Jason,
My fellow tradesmen are right, there is no requirement (based on the electrical code) to update those receptacles.
The issue might be how important is this for the sale of the home? If this is a condition of sale, then negotiate it either that you get the work done or give them an abatement based on three qualified estimates. We get these sorts of issues all the time and despite how you tell people the requirements of the code, it still becomes a small detail that can stand in the way of the sale.
Cheers,
John Kuehnl-Cadwell
Master Electrician
Datawise Solutions Inc
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